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Terve2
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2007-05-01 16:54:42
last modified: 2007-05-01 17:13:41

Evidences? Guilt is proven with evidence and in this case the evidence is overwhelming. It has been surficient for all the project admins (even including DLB eventually).

When you became project admins ? When you became a judge ? I'm talking your behavior not admins'. Admins have right to decide, but not you. That's what I have been criticizing. And also, this time was p@h. Next s@h ? then CPDN ? then r@h ? You are doing primer incident to destroy whole boinc society. Educating is ok. Blaming is not.

Whether you do next or not, somebody follows. If your act were accepted, then somebody else's should be. I don't want to accept such a silly act, and thus I am against your act. Don't make bad history here.

Edit : You said to protect boinc society by eliminating W***. Now you are doing exactly opposite direction. You were and are doing what you want to do, from my view.

Edit : Your decision of guilty itself is also based on evidences. You said to be "sufficient", and this decision is also based on the evidences. There is no solid proof.
m4rtyn
 
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2007-05-01 18:00:04

I'm talking your behavior not admins'


What are you accusing me of ? in this entire matter I have done nothing wrong!

Your decision of guilty itself is also based on evidences. You said to be "sufficient", and this decision is also based on the evidences. There is no solid proof.


I no longer need proof. In your own words "Admins have right to decide," They decided he was guilty, end of story.

You said to protect boinc society by eliminating W***. Now you are doing exactly opposite direction. You were and are doing what you want to do, from my view.


I said no such thing.

You are doing primer incident to destroy whole boinc society.


I take great exception to to the above staement It is an out an out lie all I have done is to dissagree with you and you have the gaul to accuse me of trying "to destroy whole boinc society" It seems your ego is second only to Dlb's.

m4rtyn
m4rtyn
*******************************************************

Saenger
 
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2007-05-01 18:34:26
last modified: 2007-05-01 18:59:38

Mr. Braunhemd has the right to act like a moron on his own servers, because he's the boss there, but he as well has to live with the consequences. He started this mess, he reapt what he saw.

He did nothing, nada, niets, niente against W*** until he was forced to do so by the events he himself created with his censorship bout.
He only reluctantly admitted that he did something, hidden somewhere in a thread, so that he doesn't have to fully admit his errors.
As the community of his crunchers still demanded some words from him on this issue, he simply deleted the accounts of those who refused to simply duck away under his dictatorship.

I don't know whether Mr. Braunhemd is plain dumb, an arrogant a**hole or just tucked away from reality in some ivory tower, and I don't care, he behaved antisocial.

The community deserves a full apology by him for this or we will continue to tell the truth about predictor:
It's a project, once worth crunching, that went down the drain. They don't deserve a single cycle of crunching power until they change their behaviour towards their customers/donators/volunteers.

edit
I forgot.
He stole 10K of credits from my overall Boinc, credits that I have earned with the donation of my electricity for th project Predictor, once it was worth crunching.
(picture saved, still valid but no longer in the stats)
He owes me at least this credits!
Grüße vom Sänger
mo.v
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2007-05-01 23:35:57

I'm glad to see that Predictor@Home is finally benefitting from much-needed publicity. The recent additions to its Wiki pages in German and English should attract many new crunchers. But as one of the recently-added links leads directly to this thread, we must all make sure we are scrupulously polite and on our best behaviour, whatever we need to say. We must not embarrass Willy under the glare of publicity.

At the weekend I sent an email to the Information Desk at the Scripps Institute with a few personal suggestions about how they could handle all this extra publicity so generously provided by the Wiki. Future strategies, an agenda for change, reinvention of their corporate image and so on.

As I haven't yet received a reply, I assume my suggestions are all still under careful consideration in La Jolla.

Mo
Fritzr
 
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2007-05-02 03:20:26

Been a lot of justifications for the various points of view, but a few things to list

Freedom of Speech: P@H is not required to provide this

Posts after Admin says no posts: Why is anyone surprised that they disappeared and then after what is likely many man hours of deleting posts violating this request removing posting privileges for users believed by the Forum Admin to be overdoing the repeat offenses.

Elimination of "volunteers" identified as trying to stop further crunching of P@H: Could be wrong about this, but most of those complaining about this here also are campaigning to have BOINCers stop processing P@H...

P@H is not a democracy
Folks who do not like P@H do NOT have to participate in that project
Folks who publish derogatory statements about P@H polite or not should not expect to have their remarks appreciated by the folks managing P@H

Interesting discussions, but what I find most humorous are the people who describe their months long effort to make themselves unwelcome at P@H and then can't understand why they are no longer welcome there

If you don't like the way they manage their project, then by all means stay away from it.
If you don't like BOINC in general then by all means spread this flame war to every forum you can reach

This trouble started when DLB tried to tell people that the project staff would run the project. He may not have done it right, but the volunteers donating computer time are free to quit if they disagree with management. If they wish to modify the behavior of management without damaging BOINC then perhaps they should find a way to join the management team.

The real damage to BOINC has been done by the very vocal few who couldn't shutup when asked.

Keep on truckin'
Fritz

PS Never crunched Predictor, but not because the Admin started banning posts that were in violation of the Admin's stated wishes
Saenger
 
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2007-05-02 07:35:07
last modified: 2007-05-02 07:38:31

Interesting discussions, but what I find most humorous are the people who describe their months long effort to make themselves unwelcome at P@H and then can't understand why they are no longer welcome there

My posts on the forum were not to make me unwelcome, but to help the project (and BOINC) to get rid of the evil hacker W***.

The project admin may be right in a narrow, clerical, legalistic way, but that's not the point here, that's far too little as a benchmark for worthyness, that's a sine qua non, but far from enough. A project that expects volunteer donators of computational power has to behave far more community friendly to meet the benchmark "worthy project".

Weeks of polite hints towards the perpetrator and the proper dealing with him/her only lead to a rude "I don't care about hackers, STFU!" by the project admin. He alone started this f***up with his inaction towards criminals and rude behaviour towards us helpful volunteers. He 's the one to blame for it, the helpful community only became obstinate after they were slapped in the face by Mr. Braun.

Again, Mr. Braun may be correct in a plain, legalistic, way, I can be rude in my house as well. But If I invite people to help me decorate my house, and suddenly throw them out without reason, I must not be suprised if they don't behave polite towards me.
That's what he has done. He invited us to help Predictor, we did just that, we made him aware of the criminal hacker W***, and all he did was slap us in the face and ban us for our help, no reason given to anyone.

I will continue to post about this issues, and as long as he is in an official position @Predictor, as the project admin, his actions are officially those of the project, and thus the whole project, not only Mr. Braun, has the "unworthy" tag on it's surface.

I will speak out against unworthy projects, like Shoft was in the past, and unfortunately Predictor is now. I hope they change their attitude against their volunteers to one of cooperation instead of confrontation, but it's not the first time they behaved badly. They were as well one of the main reasons for Paul D. Buck to leave the community, one of the finest members the community ever had, the creator of the unofficial Wiki.

Once for clearance the timeline of the events again:
- Trojan was discovered in begin Feb. 2007 in Italy by volunteers
- Projects were made aware by Berkeley afterwards (how exactly is disputed)
- CPDN published their actions on 23. feb.
- All affected project were made aware on the same day in their fora by me
- All projects but Predictor acted in the following days/weeks
- Predictor refused to act, just wanted the discussion to stop and keep W***
- Donators didn't like this and raised the alarm level
- Predictor behaved extreme rude towards it's voluteers, with censorship, bans, defamations
- Predictor finally had to accept the reality and act against W***, but never admitted it's foults
- Volunteers wanted to discuss this behavioural issues on the proper forum and were once again treated with censorship, bans, defamations
- Some even got their credit stolen by the admin

No explanation was given 'til now for all this actions by Predictor/Mr. Braun. He behaves like a dictator, he gets publicity like a dictator. He get's what he asked for.
Grüße vom Sänger
mo.v
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2007-05-02 15:44:40
last modified: 2007-05-02 16:17:20

Fritz, I can see the logic of your arguments, but what you say does not sufficiently address certain aspects of the situation.

*Predictor is one of many projects all running on and sharing the boinc platform. While the boinc administration provides the software etc, projects are independent. Projects are not controlled by boinc. Boinc is not the boss of Predictor and cannot tell Predictor what to do.

However, the projects running on this joint platform share many resources, some provided by boinc itself (eg the mailing lists and sharing of information, the boinc_dev forum, the new Trac bug reporting system, the boinc credits system and so on). Other shared resources are provided by volunteers (eg the Unofficial boinc Wiki, the new boinc FAQs, stats sites, translation services, the Skype help service etc).

I would argue that all projects benefit from all these services and that all projects have a practical and moral obligation to cooperate with their running. Or at the very least not to block or subvert them.

Predictor has not always cooperated even minimally in these joint efforts. For example, Saenger's copying onto the Predictor forum of my announcement about the Wate affair was dismissed and ignored, even though Wate had put at risk the reputation of boinc and a number of projects plus the integrity of the cross-projects credits system, and had criminally compromised over 5300 private computers belonging to members of the public. The same copy of my announcement has now been deleted, leaving Predictor members who do not visit other forums with no access to this announcement.

If it is true that Predictor has deleted the accumulated credits of banned members, I argue that this subverts the cross-project credit system which aims to reward all work honestly done.

*Again because Predictor shares the boinc platform with other projects, multi-project crunchers come to Predictor with certain minimum expectations. On other projects they have learned that while there is no total free speech anywhere and none of the moderators anywhere are perfect, forum posters can reasonably expect

-to receive a response. The ignoring of attention-seeking trolls is not the same thing as the stonewalling of genuine posters.

-that the moderation process re deletion of posts and bannings will be applied only when absolutely necessary, and then fairly not arbitrarily, with reasons given and the possibility of continued private discussion, with a different moderator if desired.

-that important changes in forum rules for posting will be publicly announced

-that the forum will be monitored daily, with spam and posts breaking the forum rules removed

-that all posters, whether administrators, moderators or ordinary members, are subject to the same forum rules

-that a pleasant atmosphere will be maintained as far as possible and contributions of all types recognised

-that if the existing moderators cannot cope with the forum workload and the associated tasks that it entails, the project will take on extra internal or volunteer moderators to share the burden


My impression is that the Predictor forum has failed in all these respects on a number of occasions. This has been going on for a long time ie the current crisis is only a symptom of a longstanding and underlying problem. Eg

http://predictor.scripps.edu/forum_thread.php?id=2360


Of course many former Predictor crunchers will go elsewhere. For a long time many of boinc's most respected crunchers have felt unable to touch Predictor or visit its forum. Their computer time and personal effort are warmly welcomed by other projects.

Equally, the time will come when all the reasons and arguments have been expounded more than once and we will have to leave Predictor to learn from its own experience.

And to cheer you all up in the meantime, I leave you with this website:

http://despair.com/viewall.html

Mo

Terve2
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2007-05-02 16:41:19
last modified: 2007-05-02 17:07:52

Once for clearance the timeline of the events again:
- Trojan was discovered in begin Feb. 2007 in Italy by volunteers
At this moment, you were not aware of this incident.
- Projects were made aware by Berkeley afterwards (how exactly is disputed)
No absolute information has been posted at either p@h or here.
- CPDN published their actions on 23. feb.
CPDN was not forcing other projects to do same way. Every admin has his / her's own responsibility to touch to the specific account. "What CPDN did" is not enough, and the first post was omitted by DLB. Quite simple.
- All affected project were made aware on the same day in their fora by me
Doesn't make sense for me, informing fora is not proper way to communicate with admins. Fora is for discussion and for user-based help system.
- All projects but Predictor acted in the following days/weeks
DLB waited the official announcements, which he could not see until late March. For his responsibility, he chose to wait an official announcement, and what is wrong with it ?
- Predictor refused to act, just wanted the discussion to stop and keep W***
DLB never said to refuse. He was waiting for one simple mail.
- Donators didn't like this and raised the alarm level
Because you thought you could force DLB to do. You failed. Do not do same mistake again.
- Predictor behaved extreme rude towards it's voluteers, with censorship, bans, defamations
This is from your sight. For me, many of people behaved too rude.
- Predictor finally had to accept the reality and act against W***, but never admitted it's foults

DLB obtained official announcements. Thus he started taking actions. He made what he thought to do. Not like "had to accept" matter it was.
- Volunteers wanted to discuss this behavioural issues on the proper forum and were once again treated with censorship, bans, defamations

And when I wrote from another sight, you failed to understand. At first, we have never had solid proof that W*** did commit. You must write that "abnormal behavior of W***'s account". You have never tried to correct. You think you are right because you thought so. From this timeline, I can make opposite view so easily. Be careful, we should care what to do and how to do.

Your actions in this case would be rather "allowed to do" materials for other frustrated people. You say you have borderline, and only you can view its border. You should know others would not know it at all.
- Some even got their credit stolen by the admin

DLB got it ? I thought it was thrown away.

Edit : I will be in three days offline.

Edit : m4rtyn, you still need proof. Admins took their responsibility to judge what to do. You did not. You had no way to take it. Thus if you want to post "W*** abused" or similar way, you must have solid proof. Otherwise, you should post as "W***'s account behaved abnormally".
m4rtyn
 
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2007-05-02 18:18:03

m4rtyn, you still need proof. Admins took their responsibility to judge what to do. You did not. You had no way to take it. Thus if you want to post "W*** abused" or similar way, you must have solid proof. Otherwise, you should post as "W***'s account behaved abnormally".


Terve
I just dont care anymore , Its obvious to me you will never be able to see what is right under your nose. Dose the fact that so many people have tried to explain the absurd nature of your position tell you nothing. I have like so many others tried and failed to get through to you, so be it. go and hold on to your beliefs with my blessing. I see no purpose in continuing this argument indefinately.

Good luck Martyn
Nightbird
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2007-05-02 19:10:46
last modified: 2007-05-02 19:11:11

My impression is that the Predictor forum has failed in all these respects on a number of occasions. This has been going on for a long time ie the current crisis is only a symptom of a longstanding and underlying problem. Eg

http://predictor.scripps.edu/forum_thread.php?id=2360

Ehm, i remember this thread and the user who has 'disappeared' from it.
mo.v
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2007-05-02 19:47:20
last modified: 2007-05-02 20:27:02

Terve, I'm going to explain all this to you one last time with a few extra details.

Predictor was informed about Wate via a boinc mailing list in mid-February at the same time as other projects. Rytis said on some other forum, can't remember which, that whereas the other projects affected simple accepted the information, Predictor said they needed confirmation or something of the sort. I repeat: PREDICTOR, ACCORDING TO RYTIS, WAS INFORMED AT THE SAME TIME AS ALL THE OTHER PROJECTS.

Maybe Predictor didn't receive the confirmation or whatever it wanted. But this didn't matter, because the following week my post

http://boinc.berkeley.edu/dev/forum_thread.php?id=1571

was copied to the Predictor forum. This post had already been stickied by Jorden who was the mod on that boinc_dev forum. One of the links I included led to Wate's details on Predictor.

Within a day or so, two of the Italians posted. Soon afterwards, Carl Christensen posted and it was obvious he was confirming what I had said. DLB should have recognised the name because Carl was the chief programmer for cpdn and on the same boinc email list as the Predictor admins.

However, Predictor ignored all this, probably not aware of the importance of it all.

But if DLB had followed another of the links in my post, he'd have found this - Wate's account on cpdn:

http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/show_user.php?userid=188887

Terve, now click on the Computers link.

http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/hosts_user.php?userid=188887

Now click on All hosts. You get to the list of computers attached to Wate's account:

http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/hosts_user.php?userid=188887&show_all=1&sort=rpc_time

Why do they take so long to display? Because there are 5335 computers. Now please think about that number. Could you have 5335 computers in a house? Would the domestic electricity supply take it. Right, we agree that Wate didn't have most of the computers at home. So where were the computers? Maybe he got permission from his very big college or very big company to use all their computers to run climate models and Predictor WUs etc?

Now consider this. In colleges and companies they usually replace a whole roomful of computers all at the same time and install all identical computers (identical CPU, identical RAM etc). Then they know that all the computers can do all the jobs the company or college need, plus it's easier for the technicians. In addition, usually a college or company buys all Intel or all AMD for a particular big purchase.

NOW LOOK AT THE LIST OF 5335 COMPUTERS. Are there groups of identical computers or is this a random mix? Are there groups of Intel or groups of AMD?
Are there groups of laptops and groups of desktops?

Next question. If the college or company needs powerful dual-cores with 2Gb RAM for its work, why does it also have the following computers? Click on the links to see the details of each of these computers:

#5298 - 866MHz CPU with 256Mb RAM

##5238 - 797MHZ CPU

#5104 - an AMD engineering sample

#5018 - 731 MHz with 255 Mb RAM

#4865 - 398MHz with 127 Mb RAM. Look at the computers above and below this one. Were they really next to it in a classroom or company office?

An interesting thing. Look at the first and last computers for Christmas day, 25 Dec. Look at the Results details and notice the times. Do you really think Wate was at college or at his company starting computers crunching cpdn models from five o'clock in the morning until after ten o'clock at night? Remember, he'd been there until late on Christmas Eve.

Maybe he lived at the company or college, looking after all the computers and climate models? So why did all the climate models keep crashing? When the models crashed, why didn't Wate sort things out and get the models crunching properly?

Terve, where do you now think all those computers were? Who do you think they belonged to? DLB said he'd emailed Wate. Did DLB say he'd received a reply from Wate? No, he didn't. As soon as DLB had investigated Wate, he took action and exterminated him - account, computers, credits.

If you had 5335 computers crunching legitimately for boinc projects and all the computers were exterminated, what would you do? Contact the projects? Did Wate do this?

I know beyond doubt that if Wate had ever contacted the cpdn admins or forums to complain, I would know about it. WE WOULD ALL KNOW ABOUT IT BECAUSE I WOULD HAVE POSTED THE NEWS. End of story.

Mo

Terve, if Wate really did lead that grotesque and obsessive life, living and sleeping almost permanently at his school or company to look after climate models all constantly crashing on 5335 computers, don't you think the project admins like Carl and DLB have done the right thing to try to gently encourage him to lead a normal life again?









larry1186
 
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2007-05-09 20:49:03

http://burp.boinc.dk/forum_user_posts.php?userid=100

This Wate character is an actual person that contributed to BURP since Jan 2005, and Einstein since May 2005. What happened between then and Jun 2006 is unknown since all of the computers in Wate's account are hidden except for the multitude of compromised computers at CPDN. Jun 2006 is when hosts started showing up at CPDN in massive numbers. Wate's last post on BURP was Sep 2006, and was apparently completely unaware that their account was hijacked and showing no signs of desire to hijack other person's computers.

Can any single person create that many hosts so quickly? No, highly unlikely.
Is Wate to blame? No. (innocent until proven guilty)
Was Wate's account falsely created at CPDN and others? Yes, Jun 2006 on 4 projects looks suspicious.
Does Wate have legit accounts? Yes, at BURP and Einstein, maybe at uFluids.
Were Wate's accounts compromised? Yes, well, probably.

I must agree with Terve2 in the sense that Wate may not be the bad guy, Wate may be a victim. Personally, I would not start blaming Wate just because their account looked funny.

I don't care how the whole Predictor thing started, but here are my thoughts:
-Requesting no further posts be made on a subject is questionable.
-Making posts/threads on said subject after said request was made is wrong.
-Deleting posts/threads on said subject created after said request is right.
-Banning users who continued to post on said subject is right.
-Banning/deleting without giving an explanation is sometimes warranted, but wrong for isolated instances (this situation was a swarm, not isolated)
-Creating additional accounts so that a banned user can post again is WRONG!!! (to stress this, you broke the rules so you got punished... yet you are adamant that you did nothing wrong and demand an apology)
-Banning IP ranges in response to multiple accounts being created is right to stop the perpetrators of the attack.
-Creating a bogus team to promote an attack on a project is wrong.
-Creating a team for users who were "banned for life" is ok.

Personally, I don't care about credits, if my credits/account was deleted because I threw a tantrum and did something wrong, so be it, I'd move on with my life and continue to crunch for other projects. The projects owe us crunchers nothing for our DONATED time and electricity. I never agreed to receive any amount of respect or technical help in exchange for my helping out. Yes, a good way to keep crunchers around is to treat them with respect and give them something to show for their efforts (credits) but it is not required.

Were all of dlb's actions right? No.
Were all of dlb's actions wrong? No.
Were all of the user's actions right? No.
Were all of the user's actions wrong? No.

Misunderstandings lead to confusion and hurt feelings. Heck, I'm probably making a mistake just chiming in on this conversation.

...Just my two cents...

Cheers!!

...and one more thing: What's with the "W***"? trying to hide something?
Don\'t get distracted by shiny objects.
Guest

2007-05-10 19:54:04

It does not matter what anyone says anymore about P@H. For some it is too late

I now regret ever crunching for Predictor. This incident has left an ugly wound on the project that will not soon heal. I wish that that situation would not had come to this.

All we really want is an apology from Mr. Braun. if he was to do that. I for one would be happy to crunch again for P@H. that is if my ancient computers could! I wold even apologize for the harsh things I said about him. Although it would surprise me (pleasantly) if he did so.

::braces for potential trolling/flaming::
Terve2
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2007-05-11 14:59:02

It does not matter what anyone says anymore about P@H. For some it is too late

Yes, when some of you started flaming, it became "too late". Some of you forgot "suspicious" not "guilty". This lead to the wrong direction, blaming Wate and then dlb. Mo.v. said recently "unfortunate things happened". Yes, many people blaming could not accept this democracy. This was unfortunate. And another unfortunate was that many others incl. me could not make you understand.

I also think W*** made it. I guess uFluid might have possibility to find access points for pointing his locale. But no log files ? This was also unfortunate.

One thing I wonder. If you were W***, and you made trojan installer available on P2P. Would you use your native account for that ? Would you create a new account on uFluid whether your IP could be logged ? Maybe he could not imagine for these.
Maybe he could be a young child.

Martyn wrote like "many people many time explained". So you would do above two things obviously as normal thing as W*** did so. I would NOT.
Guest

2007-05-12 01:21:55
last modified: 2007-05-12 01:25:32

No I am not him and neither do I want to be w***
As for the understanding bit, I do see your point. Do I agree with you? No. Do I have anything to hide? No. The thing that worries me about some is that if I try to prove I am not w*** they will do their best to prove I am w***. So I will just let everyone draw their own conclusion about me.

For the record I am Krunching Kajun
Terve2
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2007-05-12 14:49:19

Kajun,
No I am not him and neither do I want to be w***

So, if you were W***, would you use your native account for homemade trojan software ? Or would you create a new account so that you would not be nailed down ?
Would you create a new account on uFluids whether your creation of account could be logged and would be nailed down ?

I know you are not W***. But you can imagine what you would do if you were W***.
Nightbird
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2007-05-13 09:14:15

No I am not him and neither do I want to be w***
As for the understanding bit, I do see your point. Do I agree with you? No. Do I have anything to hide? No. The thing that worries me about some is that if I try to prove I am not w*** they will do their best to prove I am w***. So I will just let everyone draw their own conclusion about me.

For the record I am Krunching Kajun

The team has been 'removed' and the accounts are 'gone'.




DoctorNow
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2007-05-13 09:40:53
last modified: 2007-05-13 10:20:40

The team has been 'removed' and the accounts are 'gone'.

It's true! Unbelievable...
Even my account is deleted without any notice and announcement!
What a groundless cheek! Who does think Braunie is?
Predictor should be killed off from all the stats sites!
It has not deserved to be in here and anywhere else anymore, when this unreasonable things are done from him. Just deleting accounts for fun! Guess my credits for that are gone here on the stats now, too.
Now he really pisses me off, too, and I can bear much...

Edit: I'm encouraging everyone from the old team to join my new created team BANNED FOR LIFE (The 3rd).
BOINC@Heidelberg & BOINC Confederation-member

My BOINCstats/[url=http://signature.statseb.fr/sig-335.png]My badges
mo.v
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2007-05-13 11:32:41
last modified: 2007-05-13 11:45:46

Hi DoctorNow

I suspect that the problem of unwillingness to communicate with the public may extend to Scripps as a whole and not just the P@H part of it, so attempts to show them how problems could be handled differently could be a waste of valuable time.

The Wate affair isn't unique. An apparently similar earlier case was discussed here

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=27739

I'm afraid it's a very long thread that gets side-tracked into the discussion of other issues. Extremely interesting nevertheless.

Such cases put project administrators and programmers in a difficult position. They can't disclose all the details they must have like ISP numbers of computers' last contact with the server (which would reveal locations) because this would breach people's personal privacy. So we have to trust them to make the right decisions on behalf of their projects and the whole boinc community, even though we never see all the evidence they probably have.
Guest

2007-05-13 14:48:06
last modified: 2007-05-13 15:28:13

I tried to be a peacemaker.

I have failed.

I contemplate my next move (if any).
Nightbird
BAM!ID: 132
Joined: 2006-05-11
Posts: 85
Credits: 0
World-rank: 0

2007-05-13 17:32:48

I tried to be a peacemaker.

I have failed.

I contemplate my next move (if any).

Stop to contemplate your next move and do something useful for the 2nd Team and its members : back up stats.
Probably that in some hours with the next upgrade, all will be lost...
Cori
 
BAM!ID: 2
Joined: 2006-01-09
Posts: 1351
Credits: 69,052,230
World-rank: 12,870

2007-05-13 22:01:41
last modified: 2007-05-13 22:35:11

... Edit: I'm encouraging everyone from the old team to join my new created team BANNED FOR LIFE (The 3rd).

I'd like to but my account was wiped today as well. So I can't join anymore.

EDIT#1: And of course it was my original account with at least 24K credits I have honestly crunched for!

EDIT#2: Found one of my "posting accounts" and joined the 3rd BANNED team. But of course you won't see me there because my credits are gone with the other account.

EDIT#3: yesterday there was no RAC needed to post on P@H forums.
Now that the BANNED team and its participants' accounts are deleted the RAC requirement is set to 1 again to make sure no one of the deleted users can complain!!!

Posted 12 May 2007 3:14:43 UTC
Last modified: 13 May 2007 16:05:50 UTC


There is currently no RAC requirement for the forums.

dlb


CORRECTION: There is now an RAC requirement of 1 to post in the forums.

dlb


(From The last to post here with enough RAC wins.)
Greetings from Cori
mo.v
BAM!ID: 25128
Joined: 2007-05-01
Posts: 280
Credits: 0
World-rank: 0

2007-05-13 23:13:19

I've just tried to post in the Predictor Help section. It also requires a minimum credit. As this must deter newbies who are having difficulties getting started, the only possible reason for reimposing the minimum must be to make sure there are no complaints (there) about more account/s being annihilated.
Nightbird
BAM!ID: 132
Joined: 2006-05-11
Posts: 85
Credits: 0
World-rank: 0

2007-05-13 23:18:08
last modified: 2007-05-13 23:21:53

Ehm, my only account has been deleted (of course).

But at least we have some winners at P@home (look at the top users/Rac).
Where is their credibility ? very low.

edit :
http://predictor.scripps.edu/forum_thread.php?id=2592
-> user id=78923 was Krunching Kajun (deleted)
Guest

2007-05-13 23:43:25

I am not hurt by this but I am upset that all the other accounts were deleted.
I apologize to teammates and friends.

As for dlb......... well I will not post what I feel here because I respect Willy, the moderators and users here.

I will not apologize one bit to P@H, I tried to make peace on neutral ground.

It is blood on their hands now.
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